Oops ... once again my slow 2 finger typing ... sorry for duplicating information.:o

Ravens53 .... absolutely agree ... good points.:cool:

prkeefer wrote:

I have a question, which may seem simple for many of you professional electricians, but I cannot seem to figure it out. I recently purchased a new chandelier lighting fixture for the kitchen in my house. As the previous lighting was working properly, I installed the new light by connecting the two black and white wires then grounding it. When turning on the circuit breaker, the breaker instantly tripped off. I then tried disconnecting the ground wire, for whatever reason, and the light turned on; however the switch controlling the light in the room had no function and wouldn't turn the light on or off. First of all, I don't really understand how the ground wire would affect the operation of this light. Secondly, does the fact that the circuit breaker instantly trips off when turned on mean that that breaker is bad and needs replaced? Does anyone have any experience with this specific situation? Any sort of information you can supply would be very helpful. Thank you in advance...

The only way a ground is going to trip the breaker is if the ground and the hot is connected to the same point. That could be a short in the light, however with the other problems you stated, I would have to suspect you have it wired wrong. For better help we need to know exactly what wires and how many you have in the box and to what you connected the ground.
Jack

YukYuk wrote:

prkeefer,

If, for example your incoming power (from the panel direction) for this fixture location was at the light, and continued on to another working location from there, or terminated the circuit there, and from that light location hot to your switch loop was routed this would explain the results you mentioned, since as you described it you joined all black wires present with the fixture's black wire, and all white wires present with the fixture's white wire, and all grounds present with the fixture ground - you may have created a direct short and grounded your "hot" via the fixture and its ground wire. This is evidenced by your first wiring attempt having the circuit breaker blow instantly, and when disconnecting the ground not having the circuit breaker blow instantaneously but having the light in an "always on" state.

A switch loop can be wired into a branch circuit in a number of different ways. Most important is to determine before you begin where power from the panel is and the onward path of the circuit. It is common in wiring systems with 2 wires or 2 wires plus ground to remark the white wire and use it in a simple switch loop.

Before you began your project did you observe and take note of the wiring on the original fixture? Did you notice a piece of black electrical tape or other color (not green or gray) marked on a white wire? Did you notice a black marker notch on the white insulation? Did you take any notes or snap a photograph before you began?

Examine also carefully, as sometimes an aged white insulation wire can yellow overtime, and look similar to an old yellow insulated wire. Do you have testing equipment at your disposal, if so what? Have you ever traced the path of a circuit?

Another possibility is that you have another issue elsewhere in the circuit or switch loop - i.e. an arc fault situation, loose wire or nicked insulation, or a nail penetration, etc. broken switch, etc. in addition to your apparent wiring error.

Hope that helps.

There is another light past the light fixture I am trying to install in my kitchen, which is an outside porch light. This light is still working properly. I guess I don't really know where to go from here except to maybe contact an electrician, but I would like to try and rectify the situation before doing so. It sounds like the first scheme you posted in your last reply fits the description of what I am seeing, though not being an electrician, I cannot be certain. There were no marks or tape to indicate anything out of the ordinary with the light originally installed, though I did not take a picture or remember anything out of the ordinary with the original light fixtures connection. I do not have any sort of electrical equipment to help out with this problem either. How would one go about rectifying this problem in a way that wouldn't ruin the circuit breaker or wiring already established if the solution does not work out? Your last post was helpful, but if you have a simple fix to this problem I would love to experiment on the light, given the power is off haha. Thank you

I may get flamed for making this quick and dirty suggestion but it's worked for me. One way to easily test the fixture is to effectively plug the black and white wires of the fixture into an electrical outlet.

By "effectively" I actually mean do this:
1. Put the fixture in a safe location where it won't cause any problems SHOULD it cause a short etc. If you can do this outside on a concrete sidewalk etc... all the better. It should be away from people, pets, and flamable items to be safe... but close enough where you can see it when the light (hopefully) comes on.

2. Find a good heavy outdoor extension cord. With the cord unplugged, firmly insert the black and white fixture wires into the female end of the cord (one wire in each vertical slot). If the fixture has a ground wire you can place that into the round hole of the cord. Be sure the wires are well inserted to make good contact.

3. Plug the extension cord into a working outlet. If you have access to a switched recepticle, all the better. That way you can control the power from a wall switch and keep even more distance. The important part is to use a good heavy cord and a grounded outlet.

4. Check the light. If it doesn't work, unplug the cord and check the wires and try again etc until you are satisfied that the fixture is bad. Most likely it will work and you can rule it out as your problem.

Again, this probably isn't OSHA approved :eek: or for the faint of heart... but it works and CAN be done safely.